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Cozy Coven Chats with Jenny C. Bell
Cozy Coven Chats shares the witch's journey. Jenny C. Bell has been a witch for over three decades and believes it's an empowering path. Jenny seeks to reclaim the word witch as well as the power of the witch's story. Join Jenny in exploring all weird and wonderful of being a witch.
Cozy Coven Chats with Jenny C. Bell
Granddaughter Crow: Reclaiming Your Spiritual Gifts Through Shadow Work
Imagine being raised in a family of Christian healers, only to discover that your true spiritual path lies in embracing the very practices they warned against. This is the remarkable journey of Granddaughter Crow, a Navajo shaman, witch, author, and spiritual guide who joined me for one of our most illuminating conversations yet.
Born into the Navajo Nation but raised with strict Christian dogma, Granddaughter Crow was groomed from birth to become a spiritual leader—just not the kind she ultimately became. After being cast out at 17 for questioning religious teachings, she spent years denying her innate spiritual gifts until a life-altering injury forced her to confront her true calling. Her story powerfully illustrates how our greatest challenges often become doorways to our authentic path.
What makes this conversation particularly relevant for witches and spiritual seekers is Granddaughter Crow's approach to shadow work through animal guides. Her book "Shamanism and Your Shadow" focuses on four animals traditionally considered taboo—the raven, snake, owl, and wolf—and transforms them into powerful allies for inner healing. As she explains, these creatures, like our shadow aspects, have been misunderstood and feared, yet contain profound wisdom and power when approached with respect and openness.
The most transformative insight? Shadow work exponentially increases your magical ability. By integrating those hidden aspects of yourself—those gifts and traits you've buried due to shame or fear—you become whole, and wholeness is the source of true magical power. For anyone who has struggled with feeling disconnected from their spiritual gifts or who fears exploring their shadow, Granddaughter Crow offers gentle but powerful guidance, beginning with simply acknowledging that the natural world sees you as much as you see it.
Whether you're new to shadow work or looking to deepen your practice, this conversation offers practical wisdom, emotional resonance, and a profound reminder that our power lies in embracing all aspects of ourselves—especially those deemed taboo.
For more from Granddaughter Crow: https://www.granddaughtercrow.com/index.html
Hey witches, welcome to another Cozy Coven Chat. I'm your host, jenny C Bell, and today I have the great pleasure to bring to you a conversation with Granddaughter Crow. Granddaughter Crow is a medicine woman, public speaker, teacher, intuitive reader and author of Wisdom of the Natural World. Descended from a long line of spiritual leaders, she is an empath medium and member of the Navajo Nation leaders. She is an empath medium and member of the Navajo Nation. She was voted Women of the Year in 2015 by the National Association of Professional Women. For more, you can learn about her by visiting granddaughtertocrowcom.
Speaker 1:And in this conversation we are discussing her latest book, shamanism and your Shadow Using Animal Guides to Explore and Heal your Inner Self and your shadow using animal guides to explore and heal your inner self. And this is such a wonderful conversation about shadow work and also about taboos. So each one of the animals in her book has taboos and superstitions surrounding them. The word witch has taboos and superstitions surrounding it. It is such a beautiful story to hear her journey from a very religious background to kind of running away from that and then refinding herself as a witch and later reclaiming her place as a shaman. So I hope you enjoy this chat and without further ado, here it is. Welcome, granddaughter Fro, to Cozy Coven Chats. If you could please take a moment to introduce yourself to our listeners so they can get to know you a bit better.
Speaker 2:Love it. Jenny, first, thank you so much for having me on this podcast. I've been listening to some of your episodes and I am really jazzed about. I just said jazzed. So now you know that I'm old, in my 50s, that's what we used to say. I'm really jazzed about being here and talking to the Coven of Witches and having a cozy conversation. A little bit about me. They call me Granddaughter Crow. I am born Navajo and I'm from the navajo nation. I do have some dutch and, um, I'm an author, podcaster, public speaker, all around, crazy crow just remember granddaughter crow and I am also. Most people know me as shaman, but I'm also a witch.
Speaker 1:Thank you, and so I just want to say thank you for you being here. For those of you that don't know, I actually got my podcast started because of Granddaughter Crow. She was able to have me on her podcast and then give me a few quick tips on how to start my own and really took a lot of the anxiety away from me, and so I wouldn't have my podcast if it wasn't for you. So thank you so much for taking your time and just being kind and really being. I know you often say you're a teacher, but you really are. It's a very natural thing. You taught me in such a quick, easy way that I felt very confident, so I wanted to thank you really are. It's a very natural thing. You taught me in such a quick, easy way that I felt very confident, so I want to thank you for that.
Speaker 2:You're welcome and, yes, I will be your podcast godmother. Is that what you just? You asked me to be the podcast godmother. I am here for the job.
Speaker 1:Okay. So I am very curious. So you definitely said you're a shaman, but you're also a witch. Now I'm on.
Speaker 1:I often follow Native TikTok and I have read a lot of literature by Native American authors. That was something I studied in college and I have learned that a lot of times witch is not a positive word at all in a lot of Native American tribes, and so you know there's a big for those of you that don't know they're listening In a lot of cultures there's a really big distinction between witch and shaman, or healer and witch, and a lot of times the witch is not a good thing, that's not a good like connotation, and a lot of times the witch is not a good thing, that's not a good like connotation, and it's very separate. And I know a lot of witches see themselves as healers, as helpers, like in our Western kind of, you know, modern culture, but a lot of other cultures don't see it that way. So I was like really surprised that you were okay with the term witch. You're like, yeah, you can say that, and so I would love to know why that is.
Speaker 2:Right. So that's. I'm so glad that you're bringing this awareness to the listeners, because that's one of those questions that, if you know the answer, you probably spoke out of turn and got you know hushed for it by calling an indigenous person a witch. So for me, I see the word witch as wise one, the one who carries wisdom, and also it is kind of spooky and taboo, let's be honest. And that's so awesome for the Navajo culture and again, I'm only going to speak on as a person, just granddaughter Crow. I'm not speaking on behalf of the Navajo Nation, but there is a lot of what we would call superstition or what others would call understanding the unseen world as a Navajo, and in that, jenny, I'm going to bring up a very taboo thing for your audience, a gift.
Speaker 2:There is this term called skinwalker. This is a term that you will not see a lot of literature about. Maybe you'll start seeing it more and more and more because of the descendants, like like me, of the indigenous people and more of the silhouette of the future of what that culture may look like. Skinwalkers basically are shapeshifters. They have a negative connotation, so much so that if you know or sat with a Navajo and you say that word skinwalker, they will stand up and leave the conversation. You might not ever hear from them again because of the understanding of our words, our speech, our thoughts, our things, and when we say something it is heard and so watch what you say and then when you say that word, you're actually calling that energy to you. So and then in this skinwalkers tend to be more mischievous, more like curses and bad spells. Curses and bad spells.
Speaker 2:However, again, it's with, it's been an oral culture and hasn't been written in like since the last 200 years, and so there's not a lot of history, it's all oral. But I have the understanding within my DNA, within my body and within my knowledge and some things that have come to me, that originally skinwalkers were not negative and that they did positive things. So when you look at skinwalkers, they hurt people really bad and they do all these things right, and so they associate those with the term witch. So, yeah, why does Granddaughter Crow, as a Navajo shaman, also feel very comfortable in my own skin to call myself a witch, not only because I understand that witch means wise ones, but also because I am taboo. I write books about shadows, the crow and the raven is taboo to the Navajo Nation. So I'm that black sheep, so to speak, you know, and but I find being a witch amazing. In fact, I adopted the term and the identification as witch prior to adopting the term shaman prior to adopting the term shaman.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow, okay, so so can you tell us a little bit about that then, like your journey into first kind of embracing being a witch, and then from there later embracing common?
Speaker 2:Absolutely so. In short, I am raised by Reverend Jackson Yazzie, of the Christian faith in the Navajo Nation, and he met my mother, who is Dutch, in seminary school. So they both graduated as reverends. So I was raised extremely Christian dogma. But when I was I think I was still in my mother's womb they became what the term is called spirit filled, which means that they lay hands on the sick, the type of Christians that lay hands on the sick and pray for people and see visions and prophesy and all of those gifts right. So I literally was raised by my parents to do that and I was the one who was selected to be the next carer of that torch.
Speaker 2:Well, when I was probably about 15, I started asking questions about, well, challenging I didn't realize that I was doing it, but I was challenging their belief system. And anyway, long story short, really horrible I. They kicked me out when I was 17, because they thought that I was possessed. Possessed because who else would challenge God except for the devil. Right, and I say this for your listeners Like years ago I thought that this would be like, oh, this is such an odd story, but I have found that the more people I tell this story to. They're like.
Speaker 2:I had similar things. My parent wasn't a reverend, but all of that kind of stuff, the questioning of man-made religion, and so I could see visions. I did all of that fun stuff and then when I left home, I ran as far away from anything spiritual as I could. I was like this is the muggle world even though that term wasn't back then right. This is the mundane world. I am not going, I don't see anything, I don't hear anything, blah, blah, blah. All of that was just. You guys were just. That was crazy until I was 35 years old.
Speaker 2:So I went to school and I got a job in corporate America and I was doing all this stuff. I went to. I was walking down the street with a friend of mine and she goes oh my goodness, let's go into this witch shop. And I was like, ooh, this would get my mother's goat right, because at age 35, I was still a little hurt about it. And so go in there. I see a tarot reader. I sit down. She starts reading. She's like whoa, you're a spiritual leader, what you have, all these gifts, what are you doing? And I was like how did you know this? I thought that that. How did you know this?
Speaker 2:So anyway, secretly, I got some books and I started reading about, ooh, the four directions and the elements, and it was weird because it was similar principles that I was raised with in the spiritual connotation under the spirit-filled Christian. It was similar spiritual principles about seeing, about hearing, about energy, but different terminology and apparently lost the deity of one God, you know the monotheistic idea. And so I'm just like so, for so I was what I would call a solitary closet broom, closet witch, for I took myself through a year and a day because I read it in a book and you know all of that kind of stuff. And and then one day I went down to the shop again and I'm like um, how do you, how do you become? You become a witch, like do you have to take a class? Or? And they were like, uh, you declare it? I was like I did I get to declare it? Like I don't need somebody else telling me this. They're like you declare it.
Speaker 2:I'm like I'm a witch, I'm a witch, I'm a witch and I bought which I brought on this show, my first pinnacle. It has a little raven on it For those who are seeing this visually. If not. You can visualize my little necklace and I wore it everywhere I went. I put it on a long enough chain so that I could just tuck it into my blouse Nobody knows I'm all up in into my blouse, nobody knows. And I'm all up in corporate America. I'm a witch and nobody knows.
Speaker 2:And I felt so empowered and it was really, really cool, and so I understood it to be something that allowed me to tap into my original gifts under a different name. And the reason why I feel that that's so important to share with your listeners, jenny, is because maybe you guys have that, maybe you, maybe you used to see, you know ghosts, or maybe you used to have dreams or premonitions and you lost it because somebody told you that that's not what we do. It's time to find that, dust that stuff off, get it out of your broom closet and bring it forward and be empowered. So then I'm going on my merry way and I'm reading tarot cards, but actually I'm not reading the tarot. I know how to read the tarot, but I was reading animal cards, right, and so I'm reading animals and this and that why? Just because it makes sense to me, the oracle cards.
Speaker 2:And after a while people started saying, oh, can you teach us a shaman class? I'm like, why the hell would they ask me that? Huh, and they're like, well, yeah, could you teach us about shamanism? I never said that I they know I'm Navajo, they assume shaman. And I'm just like, for, like I don't know, maybe a couple of years, I was invited to um this lunch of this group of women and when I got there, they're like, oh, this is a shaman lunch that we all shaman women get together and we eat lunch. And I'm like, oh, wow, okay. So they looked at me and they said are you shaman? And they said Are you shaman? And I said, well, until they stopped calling me that I guess I am. So it was one of those things. Right, it was one of those things that they, they called me out because of the way that I was behaving. And so now, shamanism. I write books on shamanism, all of that. I teach shamanism, but at my core, yeah, earth, air, fire, water, baby, yo, blessed be.
Speaker 1:So okay, so I have a question because I have run into this, because your book is about shadow work and we'll talk about that in a moment. But I have run into when people deny their gifts, right. So if someone has these gifts and then they kind of like stuff them down, they become unwell in different ways. So did that happen to you when you kind of like decided that I wasn't going to do that anymore?
Speaker 2:Yeah, Um, because you know, that's an excellent question. I've never been asked that. I would say that I became overactive Like I was. I decided to go to college when I was 30. And I was full time corporate America, full-time mom. I was a single mom and I also did martial arts and I also did this and I also did that.
Speaker 2:I think I distracted myself so hard that when I was it was in 2007, I had a martial arts accident. It's a long story, but, in short, I was on my deathbed not even knowing it, but I fell really, really hard Three surgeries to both of my knees, or two to one, and one knee got one surgery and the other one got two surgeries and it put me down for the count. I couldn't do martial arts. I could do my online school, but you know, I mean that's nothing because I mean I didn't go to work, I didn't go out, all of the distractions were gone and I realized that I was sad, deeply sad, that I was not happy, that I looked really good on paper, but I felt lost. I didn't know who I was. I felt like almost like if I don't do make a change now, I'm going to turn into a puppet and not know who I am.
Speaker 2:And so it was around then in 2008,. I opened up major consulting, hurting, but I was distracting myself and ultimately they say that sometimes, when you don't listen to spirit, it hits you over the head with a two by four. Well, it hit me in the knees thrice and I finally got the message. And it wasn't that spirit was all ha ha ha, you idiot. It was more like my spirit was like finally, she's gonna listen. So, yeah, I did go through that.
Speaker 1:So would you say, because it sounds like you are a very spiritual person from birth really, and then would you say then that that would be like your, like your second spiritual awakening or your more full spiritual awakening.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, I definitely. Although you know it was very Christianized, I still reflect back on that time, as my mother was my first spiritual mentor, was my first spiritual mentor. She taught me how to sit and pray and speak in tongues, lay hands on all of it to the extent that they were planning on me dropping out of school at 16 because that's legal, and going to seminary school online and just becoming a reverend. I mean, that's how core it was. It was very gifted as a child, and so then I would say that I ran away and so, yeah, I would say it was my second spiritual awakening. Yeah, I never thought about that either. Jenny, look at you. Are you a therapist or something?
Speaker 1:This is great, well, actually. So I used to be an English teacher. That was my past career and I had this TA who would always say the doctor's in, and because I would just have student after student come tell me their story and never would really give them advice, because it wasn't my place. I'm more like ask questions and then by the end of it they'd know the answer, but I never really told them the answer, you know. So that's part of why I wanted to do a podcast, like I'm good at listening, I'm good at asking questions, but I wanted to share.
Speaker 1:My story is kind of similar. I was a very spiritual child and grew up Catholic. I wanted to be a priest. Then I found out I couldn't be a priest because I was a girl and I was like, definitely I would pray all the time. I just felt like I felt my angels. I knew they were there. I just felt this deep connection and then that led me later to witchcraft and all of that, and I've talked about that here on the podcast.
Speaker 1:But then I really went into the broom closet so deeply. At one point I didn't even have an altar anymore. I wasn't using my tarot cards, nothing, and I had just really like denied that part of myself. And then, what do you know? I got physically sick. The person who was caretaking for my child ended up being using using drugs. My work became a hostile, horrible workplace and I ended up like resigning from my job. Doing this whole health journey and, just like you, felt incredibly sad, like when I finally slowed down and I stopped all the busyness I was like I'm not really happy doing what I'm doing anymore.
Speaker 1:And it's not that I didn't love teaching. I had an astrologer tell me my nervous system wasn't cut out for that, because it just wasn't. It's like my nervous system is very sensitive and I always gave 110% when I was a teacher and I was always like I'm an empath, I'm picking up on kids' feelings. I'd have students tell me something. I already knew what they were going to tell me like, oh, you're pregnant. How do you know that? You know it's just like I always just knew, and so it was like a big, just a big sponge, and then I just got sick. So I really identify with that story and I think a lot of people can, because you know, I feel like the creator whatever you want to call brings us to our knees sometimes when we are not living our purpose and we get a chance. It's like you, you did it, you had a chance. It's like okay, I can either take a change or I can just go back to doing what I'm doing, but you did the change and you seem much happier.
Speaker 2:I would say right for the change 100% because you know, 20 years later, I am me, I'm not lost, I know who I am, I know what I stand for, I know what I believe in, I am empowered. I don't have to impress. You know the workplace, I don't have to do any of that. I get to be me and it's. I also want to compliment something that you said, that that does happen in a lot of stories, where you fall and you go down for the count and spirits like here's your opportunity. And I think that that happens to a lot of people and it's not a punishment, people, it is literally. They are throwing you a lifesaver because if you don't change it around, you may lose sense of self and that's not good. I don't know who, or I'd probably be a bitter old, cranky, condescending, judgmental woman at point if I wouldn't have made that change. I don't know, but it's very likely. It's very likely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel very similar started to become jaded, started to become a really unhealthy like my body was like shutting me down, just like your body shut you down. And I think sometimes, when we're a little extra stubborn, that's what, like, the creator needs to do is like, well, I'm going to shut her down because then she has no choice but to reflect. Now that she can't move, she's got to reflect, right? So some of us need a stronger message, I think. But that's OK, right, and so that to me is kind of part of the shadow work journey.
Speaker 1:I do want to say I do love your book. It's called Shamanism and your Shadow Using Animal Guides to Explore and Heal your Inner Self, by Granddaughter Crow. What I love about this is using the animal guides because there's a lot of books and a lot of methods. Probably since Jung introduced the shadow to us, there's probably like so many things. Right, I've read a lot of books, but animals inherently are so healing and not scary, and I've seen a lot of people like you you're talking about coming from like a Christian background.
Speaker 1:They have like religious wounding and they don't even want to call on deities because they're really scared. They're like I don't. That makes me feel uncomfortable inside. I don't want to call on God. I don't even want to call on deities because they're really scared. They're like I don't. That makes me feel uncomfortable inside. I don't want to call on God. I don't want to connect to angels but animals. As we know, they don't judge us and it's such like a gentle spirit. So I would love to hear a little bit more about the book and why like we, as witches in general, really need to embrace and work through shadow work.
Speaker 2:Absolutely and you hit the nail on the head in working with animals opens up a natural receptor, irregardless of what culture you come from, what belief system, what religion and what all of us up. Because animals are global and they're also very easy to access, because we even utilize them to talk about sports teams. We'll have mascots, we will utilize them to talk about cars, like a Bronco or a Jaguar, and we utilize them to describe each other or ourselves I'm a night owl or he's as slow as a turtle. We utilize those imageries, so it's very natural and safe for us, and so when we work with these animal guides in doing the shadow work, it does open up that natural receptor, and some of the feedback that I've been getting from people who have been reading it are like I feel more comfortable doing shadow work in this way with the animals, because then I have a companion to guide me and I'm not by myself with my own shadow, which I feared, they told me to fear, and so it's really amazing and why do I believe that it is beneficial One? I think it's beneficial for everyone to do shadow work, for everyone to do shadow work, but I'm also wise enough to know not everybody's going to do it. However, I would highly, highly, highly recommend any witch or spiritually curious person to do it, because it will one uncover those hidden gifts that we were talking about earlier. It will show you. You'll remember. Oh my goodness, I did used to see grandpa or whatever in the corner, and mom told me not to, and that was the devil. So I stopped seeing it and so I hid that because I was ashamed of it. So it became part of my shadow right. And so there we do hide. When we get shamed for things, we hide them, and hence shadow. Shadow means hidden, and so, one, it will bring out a lot more of your gifts. Two, it will increase your magic exponentially, and the reason why I mean I didn I didn't do you know a quantitative research study around this.
Speaker 2:However, I have experienced it in my life when I am going to spell cast and I am like justice, I'm going to do a ritual and I'm going to call in justice. Well, honey, when you call in the energy, this is what I have found when you call in the energy of justice, it's not just going to go. Oh, hi, there I'm justice. What did you want from me? It's going to go. Justice is here, and I am going to look at everything that you're doing to make sure that it's just.
Speaker 2:And so if you haven't done your shadow work, that could be really messed up situation. If you know what I'm saying, you know. And so it's kind of like when I understand and embrace my shadow, not only do I receive more gifts, but it is half of me and now I am more whole. It is the the yin and the yang, it is the day and the night. Everything in the natural world that has the sunlight hit it casts a shadow to include me and you. And so if we go oh, no, no, no, I don't have a shadow.
Speaker 2:It's like huh, you're denying a huge, powerful, creative part of yourself, and when you do shadow work, it does. It's not all like, oh, I'm going to go into the dark room and all the boogie monsters that I've ever feared of come out Maybe, but that's just your mind playing tricks on you, or that old belief system of the people who don't want you to do shadow work. And why wouldn't they want you to do shadow work? Because when you do shadow work, you know more about your totality, who you are, and you become stronger. Oh, so maybe we should do shadow work so we know more about ourselves and become more powerful authentically and we get to work our magic exponentially. And you can quote Granddaughter Crow on that one. I'll die on that hell. Do shadow work, it will increase your magic exponentially.
Speaker 1:No, I think I know that's true from my own perspective, and I always say part of why we also do shadow work is because the shadow is the feminine. You know, we all come from the darkness, we all return from the darkness, and our very Christian, very patriarchal society is all about the solar, the light, right, it's like they want to just focus on the sun and the light. They don't want to focus on the shadow, because the shadow is the unknown, the shadow is the feminine, the shadow is all the things we don't understand, that we can't prove with science, right. And so for me, it's like it really a lot of people, I think, are drawn to witchcraft because they're looking for something different and they're looking for a way to like, realign their self, rebalance. And you can't do that if you don't bring in the feminine, because all of us are like in the Western society, most of us are just in our masculine all the time, regardless of our actual gender. It doesn't matter, because we're just constantly doing and like what do you do for a living and what did you accomplish today? It's so masculine, whereas the feminine is like, more about like.
Speaker 1:Did you rest today, did you nourish today? What intuition did you have today and I feel like the shadow work helps balance that and it can be, like you said, a little scary for people, but they and I like that. They have an animal guide. I would like to know how and why the animals were chosen Like that. Why did you pick those animals? Did they pick you kind of? You could share that story with everybody.
Speaker 2:I love it. Yes, so the four animals that are in the shamanism are the raven, the snake, the owl and the wolf, and I would definitely say they chose that role in this book. It was almost like a no-brainer, it was like one of those well, obviously this one and obviously that one. And then, in thinking about like why would they raise their hand for that role, it really became a lot more clear. Because ravens, snakes, owls and wolves can be very taboo to a lot of people and in children's stories.
Speaker 2:So if you are watching a movie and they go to a graveyard, the soundtrack will have ravens or crows in the background. Or if you read about, you know, the Garden of Eden, who was the devil, the snake, the serpent, or, oh, owls are a sign of death is around, plus they look alien. Owls are a sign of death is around, plus they look alien. And or the wolf well, we all know about the big, bad wolf and how he's going to try to blow our house down. So those, those are taboo, but these are brilliant, amazing, powerful animals and they reflect aspects of the shadow. The shadow is taboo, but it is amazing, it is beautiful. But if you've only heard those stories about. Don't you know, don't play with that, don't talk, don't say that, then you're missing out on a lot of empowerment. So I think that's why they chose to be in this book.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I personally I work with animals and animal guides in my own practice, and those are four that I've worked with. And Wolf came to me at like 19. I was in a pagan meetup group and the we had a great leader's name was Sid. My mom was real nervous about me going to this man's house and she learned he was gay and had a partner and she was like oh, never mind, you're fine like now, I don't have to worry about your safety because you're only 19, right? So he would plan these outings for us and he planned a visit to a wolf sanctuary um, it's in Lucerne Valley and the woman who ran it she's Native American. She took in all kinds of strays, so like wolves that were pets a lot of times, held by like a drug dealer, used as a guard. She had a lot of people that were formerly houseless and they worked for her, and we went there and she had just acquired a young white wolf and she was very scared and we were all sitting on the ground in circle and she said you know, her name is Tanya. And Tanya was saying like we're just gonna like, we're just getting her used to people. So if everyone can just like relax, and I was the only person she approached and this white wolf came and she like smelled me and like laid her head on me and just I have pictures and it was.
Speaker 1:I remember going to dinner with my friend after and we were talking about how it was sublime, that experience that's like terrifying and awe expiring and holy and spiritual. And I went back to the wolf sanctuary. Many years later I brought my husband for the first time and that wolf was now elderly but she remembered me because they never forget a smell and it was just proof that animals are, they're amazing, they can guide us. And so after that experience, I really would call on wolf energy, I would like pray for the wolves of the world to come back and be able to reclaim their place. And then I would. I had like wolf statues and wolf T-shirts, like I just really embraced that because, you know, growing growing up, I read the stories of the Big Bad Wolf and the Red Riding Hood and the wolf and later taking classes and studying fairy tales and folk tales in college, like really learning that the wolf was symbolic of men.
Speaker 1:Fairy tales and folk tales in college, like really learning that the wolf was symbolic of men, you know. And Red Riding Hood, she's the innocent young girl with the scary man. That's what he actually represented, and so it was just I love. I love that you chose them, because they are the ones that everyone is saying is taboo or they're afraid of. You know, so many people are afraid of snakes and I like love ravens and crows and I will like die on that hill Like they're the best. I talked to the ones that come to my yard. They're super smart. They're as like smart as a seven year old, like they're amazing animals, and so I love it's like you're, you're giving them. You're giving them a chance, like being in this book. Like you're, you're changing the collective consciousness.
Speaker 2:You know they're getting this chance to like reclaim their place as a spiritual holy helper. I think I love that. Thank you so much for that, because that's one of the things that is coming back as feedback is, people are like, oh, and then the raven came, and then the owl, who does this? And yeah, and, and they're becoming allies, our spiritual allies, once again. So you know, I mean how often. Why would you pick up a shamanism and shadow book when it's like, oh, you're going to be working with the bunny and the butterfly, a puppy and a kitten. You know it's kind of like. So you know, if we're gonna, if we're going to become powerful and look at who has been ostracized from society just like our shadow gets ostracized from society why not invite in the allies?
Speaker 1:I love that and I love that owl is included, because that's a big taboo in a lot of cultures, right? Especially, I know, in indigenous culture. Right, owls aren't always seen as good. They're like a scary symbol, is that right?
Speaker 2:Very, very, very scary, absolutely. I remember a couple of quick stories. I remember, see, english was my father's second language. So he was born in 1932. 1932. And so he lived, and then he, then he went to the army and then he got Christianized. Well, he went to the boarding school, got Christianized, went to the army, got re-Christianized, came out, went to seminary school and there he is.
Speaker 2:But even because of his blood, there would be stories that I would hear oh, your dad will never say the word wolf in Navajo. Why? Because he's calling it Back again. My dear witches, watch your words, because they manifest and doing shadow work actually makes them stronger, because you know what you're doing. So my dad was not allowed, his spirit was not allowed to call the spirit of the wolf.
Speaker 2:And then one day, when I was really young, my dad seemed I mean, he didn't talk that much, but he seemed like he wasn't doing very well sad. And I asked my mom, why is dad sad? And she pulled me into the other room and she's like he's been seeing owls around the neighborhood. And I'm like, what does that mean? And she goes that means somebody is going to die. So that's how close that understanding of that. These are not good things.
Speaker 2:And then I went down to the reservation and saw my cousins and and they're even, they're medicine people, but then they're just like you're playing with the serpent. And I'm like, yeah, and they're like Navajos, do not play with serpents. It causes our energy to go imbalanced. And I'm like, well, I did and I still do, you know. So there's still a lot of that you know. Oh, and also, the raven is very taboo. When I mention you know that crows and ravens are my totem, they're just like why would you do that? Why not a hummingbird, you know? And I'm just like, well, because this is who I am, I'm taboo.
Speaker 1:I love that. Um, I would like to know if there's something that, like our listeners could leave today and do like maybe one little step on their shadow work journey. Is there something they could do?
Speaker 2:Absolutely so. First and foremost, if you're listening to this and you're like, yeah, what is the next step? What can I do today without finding the book and without doing all this stuff, I will tell you that my belief system says that that curiosity within you is actually the voice of your shadow wanting you to find it. So open up your consciousness and then let's just start with the ravens and crows. People, I mean, let's just start with the ravens and crows, the winged ones. Maybe it's an owl, maybe it's a hawk, maybe it is a hummingbird, the winged ones.
Speaker 2:The next time that you see a bird in the natural world maybe he's flying over your car on the way and you're downtown, whatever Notice that bird and understand that it saw you first, except for if it was a pigeon, because they're kind of dense. But I'm a crow and I'm as wise as a seven-year-old, so I can down the pigeons, but no, but those beautiful birds crows saw you and are allowing you to see it. Hawk, that hawk definitely knew you were there. Are you kidding me? And he allowed you to see it. She allowed you to see her Eagles. They are allowing you to see them and then look at them and not only understand. You see me too. That's where you start building this connection, where it's not like we're watching a screen, there's a play going on and I've got to learn my lines. It's more interactive that you are a part of this natural world and then see where it flies, see if it's sitting there. What is it doing? Is it sitting there looking at you? Maybe that's a message for you to stop flying around and sit down and observe. Is it headed towards your work? Maybe that means you need to get to work. You know whatever the message is, but they are connected with you. So, yeah, as I love how you call yourself the fortune teller, I'm going to adopt that, because I love that so much. Makes me feel like a cookie.
Speaker 2:No, I'm playing with you, but it's like, however you fortune tell, you don't need cards all the time, you don't always need your pendulum, you just need to take a walk in the natural world and the task is to understand that the natural world sees you too. Here is your task go out, touch a tree and tell and touch it until you know that it senses you. It is a sentient being and maybe you know because it starts getting warm under your hand. Maybe you know, because it hits you in the head with its branch, whatever it is.
Speaker 2:But connect, that's the key. Connect to the wisdom of the natural world and allow it to become alive. And, as odd as that sounds, once you start how does that relate to doing shadow work? Once you start really truly engaging in the natural world every day, understanding that you are the natural world and it is responding to you too, then all of a sudden you're not so afraid of the night or the winter, because that's the shadow, that's the darkness. It becomes organic. And that's what I that would be the task a conscious shift.
Speaker 1:That is beautiful and I thank you from the bottom of my heart for chatting with me today. I feel people are going to really walk away with some message, a task that anybody can do. They can just walk around their neighborhood and start today and shadow work. So thank you so much for your time.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, oh my goodness. And everybody out there, wherever you are, love you, love you, love you. You are loved, and maybe I will never meet you, but I don't know if you've ever seen a crow. They told me you're good people. I love that, thank you.
Speaker 1:Thank you, witches, for listening. I hope you enjoyed this chat with Granddaughter Crow and I hope she inspired you to get outside and open yourself a little more to nature as the beginning of a shadow work journey. As I've said before, shadow work is lifelong. It's not a one and done, and so it's something we're kind of having to constantly circle back to peel off another layer of the onion or go further on the spiral, so I hope this helps you. You can find her at granddaughtercrowcom and all of her socials at granddaughtercrow, and she also has a really great podcast as well called Belief, being and Beyond, so I suggest you check that out too. Thanks,
